STEVE PRICE: Lindsay Tanner is the soon to be departing Minister of Finance. He's on the line. Good to talk to you again, Minister.
LINDSAY TANNER: Good morning Steve.
STEVE PRICE: Could have knocked me off my chair when I was sitting there watching question time and you said that. Point of indulgence, Mr Speaker, I'd just like to talk about how I'm not going to stand at the next election. I nearly fell off my chair.
LINDSAY TANNER: I hope you didn't do yourself an injury, Steve.
STEVE PRICE: I didn't, you've done it for the very right reasons. I know you don't want to dwell on it. But anybody's who's prepared to walk away from a career such as yours because they want to spend more time with their wife and family and get their life back, I think you deserve a big pat on the back.
LINDSAY TANNER: Well, thanks, but, look I wouldn't claim that it's one of those things I've battled with over a number of years because of having both my little girls and also the older kids from a previous marriage and having them over a pattern of every second weekend and so on. There's lots of people out there who do this kind of juggling, Steve and some of them are in jobs that just as time consuming as mine. But you get to the point where you've really got to make a choice.
STEVE PRICE: I think it's a massive loss to the Government. A week ago you were about to go into the caucus and Kevin Rudd and Julia Gillard were going to test the votes in that caucus room. The vote never happened. You have been in the middle of this government from the beginning in 2007. Do you think Julia is the person to retain office for you?
LINDSAY TANNER: I do, Steve, we don't know what's going to happen, of course, but certainly the initial public reaction's been very positive. It's a brutal game politics. That's hardly a novel insight. But it's a very tough business and nobody likes when these kind of things eventuate but it's just part of the game and everybody's picked themselves up and getting on with the work that's necessary to both govern well for the country and to get re-elected.
STEVE PRICE: Feel sorry for Kevin Rudd?
LINDSAY TANNER: I do, but I've seen plenty of people take some very serious blows in the political sphere over the years and you always feel a degree of sympathy with people who fall foul of the fate for politics. But we all know the risks. We all know how it works and some people end up flying high and then getting crunched. That's what's happened to Kevin. But he can take comfort from the fact that there's a vast army of other people out there, including me, who never quite made it to be Prime Minister. I think he'll recover.
STEVE PRICE: Did you have Prime Ministerial ambitions at all?
LINDSAY TANNER: Oh, look, I think I was like most people, Steve, that, you know - if you ask an AFL footballer do you want to captain a premiership side, well they're not exactly thinking about it. They're not exactly aiming specifically for it. But you never limit your own ambitions. So my bottom line was to be a senior minister in a Labor Government. I achieved that. Anything beyond that I just regarded as a bonus that would be very much up to fate and luck rather than anything else and I'm satisfied that I got to be part of the Labor Government at a very senior level.
STEVE PRICE: Your still completely convinced that during the dark days of global financial crunch number one and I'll get onto whether we're going to go into another one in a minute, that you did the right thing both on the pink batts issue and on the building the education revolution and on the lump sum payments to tax payers. You're firmly convinced that that was the correct thing to do as the world started to fall apart, are you?
LINDSAY TANNER: Yes I am. It's a matter of public record that there have been some specific problems in one or two areas. But I don't think they detract from the big picture. We were facing the threat of unemployment going through the roof, of thousands of businesses going broke and literally enormous misery just sweeping through our economy and we had to act quickly. Your options are pretty limited. It might sound like an easy thing to pump money into the economy, but it's actually quite tricky. Of course some of the things that have gone a bit wrong subsequently just underline that point, that it's a very difficult thing to do. But the alternative scenario was literally like 1990, '91, you'd remember that time. I remember it well where suddenly we had 11 per cent unemployment and factories and businesses closing down all around the place. That leaves a scar for a long time. It wrecks families. It really damages lives and puts people in dreadful circumstances. So we didn't have any choice but to act to prevent that. We succeeded in doing that. Yes we've got to deal with problems that have emerged in some specific areas. But I wouldn't back away from what happened.
STEVE PRICE: But as a good Labor man you must have been filthy when you realised people were rorting that pink bat system.
LINDSAY TANNER: Oh, look, I think...
STEVE PRICE: Unqualified people getting up and sending kids up into the roof to nail down foil in houses that were still electrified.
LINDSAY TANNER: Well, look, yes, obviously that's extremely disturbing and I've basically taken the view that we need to wait until you get things like coroner's reports and so you can actually...
STEVE PRICE: That's fair but I bet privately you were filthy.
LINDSAY TANNER: Oh, look, obviously I'm unhappy about some of the things that have occurred and it does indicate that it's very difficult to run programs of this kind. The real reason we were, apart from the obvious environmental benefit and people getting lower electricity bills, one of the key reasons why that program was attractive was it offered employment opportunities to people in the unskilled and lower skilled part of the market. The problem with a downturn is that the people who suffer most are those like school leavers or people who haven't got qualifications and it was important to ensure that people in that category got a fair go as well. That's one of the reasons why it was something that we felt was appropriate. But yes the instances of rorting and unsafe behaviour are obviously extremely regrettable.
STEVE PRICE: You're still the Finance Minister in the Labor Government. Can you pull off a compromise deal with mining companies on the super profits mining tax and if you can't; isn't that going to blow a great hole in your budget, given that it's in there as a budget income item of $12 billion?
LINDSAY TANNER: Well I'm not directly involved in the negotiations so I can't really comment on the prospects of where those discussions will lead. But we are very keen obviously to reach an appropriate landing point. Keep in mind that we're talking about the government of Australia and the Parliament of Australia here that ultimately has the decision making power to determine the shape and detail of our tax system. But I can't predict where these things will head, Steve. But on the second question you've raised, the tax reform package we put together was an integrated package. So it was basically on one side the resource super profits tax and on the other side of the ledger a cutting company tax, a big improvement in what small businesses can write off immediately for tax purposes; a big improvement in superannuation which is a cost to the budget. A couple of specific improvements so that there'll be an automatic tax deduction of $1000 for all tax payers. So half or more than half of tax payers won't have to do a tax return anymore and keep the shoe box full of receipts and so on. So, if anything, if put under pressure by any reduction in the revenue from the resource super profits tax it's going to those reforms more so than the budget bottom line. Now I'm not suggesting that any of that will occur. It's really going to be a matter for the Treasury, in particular, negotiating all of these things. But people forget that there was pretty much a revenue neutral package here with increased revenue on one side and reduced revenue through tax breaks for business on the other side.
STEVE PRICE: Just two quick things before you go. Do you think that the world could potentially be headed for another downturn?
LINDSAY TANNER: Look, I think the kind of scenario that some people are painting is a repeat of '08 and early '09; I think honestly that's very unlikely. You never rule out these possibilities and clearly there's some very concerning things out there. I think probably what's more likely is just an extended period of very ordinary economic performance in Europe. The United States is taking a while to rebound but I think there are some positive signs there. Asia is still, particularly China and India, going pretty strong. So I think it's very difficult to read and I think most people in the financial markets are not exactly clear as to where things are heading for Australia. So we are still very much focused on keeping an eye on the risks. There's no doubt that there is a genuine set of risks out there. But I think people should be cautious about proclaiming that we're about to hit great global recession number two or anything. I don't think there's a reason to assume that. It's possible but I'd have to say I think fairly unlikely.
STEVE PRICE: You said you've spent your last day in the House of Reps.
LINDSAY TANNER: Well, we don't know for sure that that's the case. But I think...
STEVE PRICE: You're still pretty sharp, aren't you?
LINDSAY TANNER: I think, well I'd have to say, Steve that I don't know when the election will be and I'll probably find out just before you do.
STEVE PRICE: Just thought you might have dropped your guard a little bit in the final days; obviously not.
LINDSAY TANNER: Look, I think, look I enjoy question time. It's a lot more fun when you're on the government's side and you can give the other side a belting rather than being on the opposition side and you're the one getting the belting. But, look, it's one of those things that you don't want to do forever and I'm privileged to be part of what I genuinely believe is the most talented Labor caucus in the history of the party. I think there are a lot of people in the caucus, particularly people who came in 2007 who will be stepping up to replace people like me and others over the next few years and I think that the Party's in good shape. I think done what I've - anything that I've really wanted to do. I'm happy with the things I've done in my portfolio. So, no, I'm looking forward to moving on and doing some other things.
STEVE PRICE: Thanks for your time. You've always been very generous. I'm sure we'll speak again before election time, before you finish up. Thanks for your time.
LINDSAY TANNER: Very good to talk to you, thanks.
-ends-
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